Leaving the EU and How Britain’s Anti-Brexiteers Just Don’t Get It
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Fifty-Two percent of the people in the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland – who bothered to vote – voted to leave the European Union (EU). Forty-Eight percent of the people who bothered to vote voted to remain.
The fact that a considerable number didn’t bother to vote is immaterial. In our democracy, it is not illegal to not vote therefore only those who do bother to have a say. That’s the way it is. I don’t make the rules.
Those who voted ‘remain’ are upset that they lost – just as American Democrats are upset that they lost – at least they did within the rules of American elections. Quite how Clinton could get more votes and lose is beyond me but, again, I don’t make the rules.
Now. Those who lost in Britain – the ‘remainers’ – are continually asserting that leaving the EU will be disastrous.
As I haven’t got a crystal ball I can only conclude that they may be right – or wrong. Time will tell.
What is increasingly irritating me is their dunderheaded refusal to acknowledge the absolute correctness of why so many voted ‘leave’.
Uncontrolled immigration through open borders.
Our infrastructure is crumbling through the numbers of people in Britain far exceeding what our current infrastructure can cope with.
This has nothing whatsoever to do with racism or xenophobia. It is an unfortunate fact.
The only feasible solution is to strictly control immigration, at least until our infrastructure can catch up. This is decades away.
Related: An Englishman Compares Brexit With War of Independence
The ‘direction of travel’ of the EU is complete European integration under one government with one currency.
The ‘Brexiteers’ hate the very concept. In fact they – I will say ‘we’ as I hate the very concept – voted ‘leave’ in order to prevent Britain becoming a ‘state’ of the EU rather than an independent, sovereign nation.
I have been waiting – and continue to wait – for any ‘remainer’ to address either of these issues. To date none have.
They warble on about economic disaster and so forth – and whose to say they’re wrong? Maybe they do have a crystal ball.
What they seem incapable of addressing is the fact that the open borders of the EU have largely contributed to the intolerable strain on our infrastructure.
What they seem incapable of addressing is the fact that the ultimate ambition of the EU – as per Jean Claude Junker – is the complete unification of Europe under one government.
The entire Brexit debacle has gone way beyond the insular debates about ‘can Britain survive outside the EU?’ – yes, we can, but how well is another matter entirely.
The chasm between ‘leave’ and ‘remain’ is now one of, quite simply, ‘remain’ failing to acknowledge, let alone discuss, the greatest fears and, indeed, known facts that remaining in the EU would ultimately result in for Britain.
A satellite state of the EU empire governed from Brussels.
An independent democracy self-governing.
Those are the two choices. It’s as simple as that.
All other details are irrelevant. Yes, all other details will affect us. Damage to the economy perhaps. Difficulties of many kinds perhaps.
Related: An Englishman Wonders if Brexit Will Actually Happen
Whatever the consequences of leaving it will be worth it to avoid complete governance from Brussels. Complete governance from a European Union so corrupt it is a decade since they could get anyone to sign off their accounts.
You want to debate Brexit ‘remainers’?
Cool.
Maybe start by acknowledging the real reasons 52% voted to leave.
I’ll believe you’d dare do that when I hear it.
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Specifically for anyone who doesn’t know:
Remainers : wanted to remain in the EU as they believe it’s better for Britain primarily economically. Also generally believe free movement is a good thing.
Unclear whether they desire a fully integrated Europe with a centralised government. Difficult to get a response from them on that.
Brexiteers: want to leave the EU. Primarily as they believe national sovereignty is being increasingly compromised and don’t want a centralised EU government for Europe.
Also concerned about the population increase through free movement overloading our infrastructure. Most Brexiteers want none EU immigration drastically cut too.
Both sides sold gibberish by both campaigns.
A second referendum very unlikely but desired by pro EU side and not impossible.
Conclusion : it’s currently a mess but Britain is leaving – one way or another.
Future?: *Britain will thrive outside the EU / *Britain will struggle outside the EU / *Britain will die of boredom talking about the EU.
*Delete as applicable
Think Neil/Norman is getting desperate/hysterical even. He’s saying such distorted ‘facts’ straight from the right wing papers he obviously reads or groups he follows.
The result of the referendum was close and probably most that voted to leave didn’t have a clue they definitely didn’t understand the situation of the single/customs market for instance.
There are a lot of really thick people in my country who even think trump is great and should come here !?!? 😱
One thing N/N is right about is no one knows what will happen.
I voted remain obviously!
You can have him Cherries, we don’t want him. The only thing keeping him in place right now, are toady republicans and the fact that Mike Pence would be prez if Trump left office. Pence is worse than dolt45, if you can believe that because he puts a calm face on his bigotry and he is a TRUE believer in religion being everywhere around us.
I don’t think he’s worse. He’s bad, but not worse. I don’t think he would embarrass us, and I don’t think he’s as mean as Trump. Pence is also an animal and nature lover, something Trump is clearly not. Pence is, of course, a religious fanatic of the highest order, but I don’t think that will take him very far.
Ooooh, he’s mean alright, he hides it in plain sight. Because of him, AIDS cases went up when he was governor of his state. Had it not been for courts intervening in Indiana, women having miscarriages or abortions would have to have gone and requested death certificates and burials because of policies he wanted enacted. He is as right wing Xian zealot as they come and his policies would be the same way, we’d be in a theocracy within zero time if he was put in place. He has been in bed with the likes of Erik Prince, Betsy Devos, Koch Brothers for forever and lives for that dominionism shit taking over all aspects of society. He scares me more than dolt 45 does because he was put in for one reason and one reason only, to take over when the inevitable happened with dolt45 being booted out on his ass.
I think you might be right Jess. Ideally both these twisted carps will be run over by a train 🚂
Good! Fine! Excellent! Then address the points!!!
1) Free movement has increased the population beyond the infrastructure capabilities of Britain.
2) Junker openly stated the ultimate goal of the EU is complete political union with a centralised government.
Discuss.
See? Remainers will not even talk about the above. If they do they deny the obvious. Shame how blind some can be really.
Still we’re leaving. End of.
Incidentally Cherries.
You are showing the often patronising attitude of so many remainers.
Everyone who voted leave is thick.
Typical.
Cherries has to be right. All the cards were not on the table when the referendum vote happened. The leave vote was an emotional one and not very smart. You said you voted remain but campaign vigorously for leave. What is your right wing government doing to address your concerns about crumbling infrastructure. Nothing. You and your fellow leavers live a very confused existence.
Not at all. All governments for several decades have failed to properly invest in our infrastructure.
They are entirely to blame – not immigrants.
However, we are where we are so not seriously controlling immigration will make matters worse.
We can’t afford to remain if only on those grounds.
Where do you stand on complete monetary and political integration with a centralised EU govt?
If you look at some of the ones that voted leave, there should be zero doubt how “thick” they are, no thinking before voting is a bad life choice. They got sucked in by the big shiny thing of the moment, much like the idiots that voted for dolt45 here. Of course, now we find out, both our countries also got hit by hackers from different places to aid the right wing bringers of hate.
Both leave and remain campaigns were appallingly poor.
A stream of lies from both sides.
No wonder some people hadn’t a clue what to do
Don’t know where you’re getting that information, but our news here in Manchester is telling us if we get another vote Brexit will exit, and the people will vote to remain. I’m for another vote altogether.
Fine.
Now, where do you stand on our infrastructure crumbling, not only through a lack of investment, but also through there being more people than it can cope with?
Remaining means free movement.
Also, Junker has openly admitted the ultimate goal of the EU is complete assimilation with one centralised government.
Where do you stand on that.
I genuinely would love a remained to respond to those questions.
British politics is screwed up, like US politics. Divide and conquer. Boy are we divided.
Thank you for reminding me I’m entitled to an opinion. Stops me from sliding into hellish bigotry.
Noted for my future taking over of hell, I want a slide into it. It will be funtimes 🙂
👍😂😂😂😂😂😂
Since we’re talking about crystal balls, maybes and whatevers. If there was another referendum on Brexit tomorrow and if we could relive the 2016 General Election tomorrow, it is possible that the results would be unchanged. A damning indictment on the voters of both countries would be in order.
In your opinion – which, of course, you are quite entitled to 😜
Hear! Hear!
Look at the people over there that were interviewed, after they voted Leave that said oh shit, I did not mean to do that and wish I could have a redo on my vote Neil. It’s the same thing for the idiots that voted for Il Douche, the malignant mango Mussolini over here and all their regrets now, after voting for him. The information was out there but people voted against their best interests in both our countries and are now wanting the redo. Many of them, chose the same way Il Douche’s voters chose here, fear and loathing of “the other” taking away what they think is rightfully theirs and called it, just taking our country back when it was pure unadulterated racism, sexism inset any ism you want, it was there for the world to see and now we all pay the price for it. Look at Theresa May kow towing to Il Douche when he was there at Davos, at the same time as her, regarding the whole we’ll have your back maybe when it does finally happen for the exit deal, he’s a lying liar who lies about his lying, he won’t do shit for the UK unless it benefits him. She should be ashamed of herself, prostrating herself in front of him like that. She should have gone all, Hugh Grant against Billy Bob Thornton in Love Actually on his ass.
Lots of people who voted remain now wish they’d voted leave and vice versa…
I did vote remain for my daughter but I supported leaving – still do.
As I say, remainers – up to now – are refusing to acknowledge open borders have led to an increase in our population our infrastructure cannot cope with.
They also – up to now – have failed to address the very real concern of a centralised government running a fully politically and monetarily aligned Europe.
If remainers had the courage to discuss those very real fears the chasm between us could reduce.
There are as many believing a second referendum would increase the leave majority as those who think remain would win.
We’re leaving. End of.
Remainers should accept it and fight for their version of Brexit not keep waffling and sulking and thinking they can stop it.
Since I don’t know where you live in England as far as proximity to the halls of power, isn’t it kind of the same thing the centralized government thing? So you live in city, county x and your local city, county halls of power want one thing but then the state, do you have states there? anyway the state says, city x you cannot do that thing, even though your voters said you could, you have to do it this centralized big gubbmint way. Then it moves up the foodchain, just an example, CA wants to do (insert batshit, according to some, crazy really liberal idea here) and it finds its way to the feds, who by the way hate CA for some weird reason, the federal government says oh hell no CA, you cannot do that batshit crazy really liberal idea you have to do it the federal way. CA just goes on its merry way and gives a big fuck you to the feds and does it anyway the rest of the country finds out it works and start implementing things like it tweaked for their own areas. THIS makes sense in my head, so you all know 🙂
We have a central government in London. Then we have local government called ‘county councils’ – a county being a bit like a state.
Within the county we have city and town councils.
I then begin to lose the will to live 😜
So you are used to living with a centralized, big brother looking over your shoulder at all times because they make the rules government, depending on how far you live from it. I just saw, you live in London so you are closer to the halls of power than say Northern Ireland or Wales but the rules made in London have to be followed by those in Northern Ireland and Wales right?. What is the difference with them following London rules than all of the UK following Brussels rules?
Wales, Scotland, Northern Ireland are part of the UK.
If they pushed hard enough – like Scotland did – for an independence referendum then they could decide – as Scotland decided to remain in the UK.
We had a referendum, just as Scotland did, and we decided not to remain in the EU.
We decided ‘no’ to Brussels rules, Scotland decided ‘he’s to UK rules.
I don’t see the problem?
‘Yes’ not bloody ‘he’s’ you stupid moronic autocorrect!!! How do I switch the damn thing off????
But wait, didn’t Scotland vote to stay in the EU by a big margin. The only thing that kept them out of it, was voting to stay in the UK union of countries right? Same could be said of the countries in the UK, did anyone ask them back in the day, hey do you want to be here or were they conquered and told, you will be here and you will like it or we’ll fuck your shit up. They all got used to it, after these many centuries if you had another vote and it was to stay in, you would get used to it also.
Scotland voted to remain in the UK. The UK voted to leave the EU.
He’s never told me but I think he lives in or around Oldham, or maybe not.
Oldham in Lancashire is my home town. Been in London near Heathrow Airport for over 40 years.
Ah! I guess it right then. Might be your accent 🙂
Ee by eck….tha’s reet tha knows 😀